Jake Dockter, from Portland has been interviewing me for a book he is writing on creativity and spirituality. I thought it would be fun to post the interview here.
q: what is it about poetry that makes (or made) you say, I WANT TO CREATE THAT!?
For me writing poetry is a way to integrate my deeper values and experiences with my yearning for God’s presence. Poetry speaks in a way that a sermon or lecture often cannot– because it is a use of language that is evocative, metaphorical and deeply personal– communicating both thought and feeling.
q: what does a the written word do for you that normal language, or
other arts for that matter, do not not suffice in expressing?
Words are the most accessible and natural way that we share meaning as humans. However, we are living in a time of many words– when words don’t mean much. So I would see a difference between writing or talking that has authority and craft and another kind of writing or speaking that to me is the equivalent of literary vomit. We have too many words, but not enough words born out of deep thought and experience. We need more silence.
In terms of words over other art forms, writing has a more accessible market than painting or dance– but these are worthy pursuits. In some ways I write because I have to make money– my craft has to serve a purpose that is more readily functional at this point in my life. I imagine a time when I will have less responsibility to provide for a family when I will channel my creativity more toward poetry, sculptor or acting.
q:what is the job or the artist? does it change for a christian artist?
The job of an artist is to deeply and honestly explore their experience of being human. For someone who is Christ-conscious, the reality of God’s kingdom is naturally part of their experience of being human and this will be portrayed in their expression.
q: The Psalms in the scriptures are poetic callings to God. Do you see
the modern artist as a modern psalmist?
I really relate to the Psalms. Both the Psalmists and the prophets used poetry to connect humanity with God-longing. I like the honesty of the psalms and the anger, mourning, desperation and imagination of the prophets. Our current religious culture doesn’t provide much space for this degree of honesty– because so much of contemporary religion is about certainty and the denial of fear and doubt. The Psalms were full of doubts and fears that were voiced with an understanding that someone was listening (or should be listening).
q: how does/can or should art speak or be integrated into our quest
for holistic integration?
The arts traffic in the stuff of life: color, emotions, stories, songs, words and the topics of the everyday: love, attraction, death, hunger, etc. We long for language and symbols that bring dignity and meaning to common experiences– and this is what good film, photography, writing or poetry or painting can do. We know that we are loved and provided for because the sun comes up every morning, because we relish the first sip of coffee or tea, and because we can enjoy a few moments of laughter with a child. The kind of art I most appreciate has a degree of mystery or lift– that hints at something beyond the material world–that contains echoes of the eternal soul. The aesthetic engages all of our senses: taste, touch, sight, sound, smell and the awareness of thought– and we experience integration to the extent that our senses are relating in meaningful ways. A song can make me cry and its more than the words, the melodies and rhythms give voice to something I may feel deep inside, or the poets words might say what I know to be true in a way that is elegant and beautiful and moving.
q: how do we rejoin the the sensual, aesthetic and cultural to the
sacred? like in the story about your grandpa onas…
We need to get over the historic tendency toward dualism– a false conflict between spiritual and material. We need to find God in sex, and work and sadness– embracing the fact that God is not removed from the gritty details of life. The way we do this is by living consciously and courageously– taking the risk to be fully alive to ourselves, to one another and to the wonder of creation in a way that acknowledges the presence of the divine being that is always closer than our own breath.
q: if we were raised “to see appreciation of aesthetics and cultural
artifacts as opposed to the pursuit of the sacred.” how do we reverse
that? why is that the case in the first place, and why change it?
We all hunger for beauty and sensuality– and individuals, groups or cultures can either live consciously and comfortably in their humanity– or make parts of our humanity ugly or dirty. Either way, our hunger for beauty spills out– and it would be better to bring it into the light than to keep it in the darkness. I see people who have lived dualistically make mistakes when they open themselves up to their fuller humanity– drinking too much, becoming compulsively hedonistic. But perhaps this is the adolescent stage of becoming fully human– you can’t be human without making a few mistakes. It is really dangerous to be fully alive– aware of the depth of your own brokenness and the glory of being created in the image of the divine. For some of us, we have to learn to give dignity to practices that aren’t explicitly “spiritual” or “religious.” All of life is sacred, and so to be truly spiritual is to live in constant awareness of that glory.
q: art can be a provocative/tricky force that pushes us out of our
comfort. How have you seen this work and to be true?
how does this connect with our faith? can art validate comfort or
does it always need to be a bit uncomfortable?
Most of our arts and crafts comfort us and point us towards beauty. But there is a role that the artists plays that is provocative. Not every aesthetic creature is called to this office, and some fulfill this role with violence. The deeper issue here is learning to speak from the nature of one’s being– to speak to one’s unique view of the world– to cultivate a distinctive and clear voice. This takes a lot more work and dedication that most of us are willing to invest. And the artistic voices we most admire have learned to use their voices in services of the good and the beautiful–with a great degree of tenderness and ruthless honesty.
